Episode 17

17 - My Cabinets Have Been Hacked

Burt, the New Like Butter product, Mystery of Web Sales, Arachne 3D Printing Slicer, Brothers Neistat, and Epoxy Woodworking Stances?

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Show Info


HOSTS

Jem Freeman

Castlemaine, Victoria, Australia

Like Butter | Instagram | More Links


Justin Brouillette

Portland, Oregon, USA

PDX CNC | Instagram | More Links

Transcript
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Plug in the, if phones check the sound or set things.

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Not that one

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there you.

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There we go,

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Well, maybe a clap

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let's do that.

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What?

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Clap louder.

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I don't have any sticks around me.

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happening in your virtual world,

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virtual world.

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I play with Dolly today a little bit again, but

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played with your,

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I play with my Dolly's, in particular.

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So he can't seem to share screens.

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Maybe that's the one downside of this.

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I was chat chatting with my friend about having to wear N 95 masks and.

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Wanting a comfortable one and like how to eat in it.

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So I had deli make some images of

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oh, oh dear.

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Well, well, the concept was, I want like a quick open one, like

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obviously the ear flap thing, but like, I was like, you know, those

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like nursing bras that are like quick open, like, I want that for a mask.

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And Dolly was like, you can't do this.

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Like it violated, I, I put like nursing bra as N 95 mask

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and it violated their terms.

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and I was like, do it again.

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You're gonna banned.

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I was like, oh,

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You've just violated my terms.

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I think they're really quite disgusting.

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that?

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One's got an arrow.

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they're really high resolution.

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Surprisingly too, you know?

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I know frightening.

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I just made the mistake of clicking on one and expanding it.

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It gets real big.

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Like the one cheeseburger, I think my favorite's the black mask one with

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the guy holding it and it's looks like the burger has hair to me, which

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feel a little bit ill.

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sorry.

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I just, I just got outta bed and had two sips of coffee.

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are you vegetarian?

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I didn't know

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Sammy, Sammy.

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Yeah.

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I can do a, I can do a, a veggie burger next time.

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How's things for you.

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just need to that out.

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Good, good.

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I haven't been making anything that fun.

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it's important work.

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good,

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It's like.

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When I asked my wife how her day was and she goes, it was fine.

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I'm like, oh really?

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What, what happened?

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What was fine?

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I've been chipping away at my default diary, making, making kind of slow,

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steady progress, doing, trying to do the same thing every day.

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My two hours of quitting and

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It's always impressive.

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two hours of marketing and my two hours of random stuff.

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People that listen to this with like normal nine to five

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jobs that don't own a business.

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You're like, what, how come they can't just do the same thing every day?

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Why is it so hard?

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yeah, finding a rhythm and thinking, I was thinking about that writing in.

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I think, I think I can only find that rhythm cuz I've

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outsourced enough of my job to

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Yeah.

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be distraction free for those chunks of the day.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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So Ben's really flowing with the production management role.

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Now got a good rhythm.

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Sarah's taken on HR and sort of more responsibility with business

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management, bigger picture stuff.

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So she's cracking on and making decisions, and taking actions on stuff.

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And, it's, it's meant that I've yeah, I've been left alone a bit

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more and I've had a bit more time to focus, which has been nice.

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Mm-hmm that?

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Yeah, that sounds delightful.

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I've been slack with my R and D slot.

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Still not getting up in time.

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I think I've done about an hour of play time this week.

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So feeling the lack of that, but

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Yeah,

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otherwise it's been good.

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not enough recess.

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Just

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We should relive it.

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Re do you call it, do you call it recess in, in like grade school

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when you get to go out and play?

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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and call it recess in the morning when you do your D time.

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Yeah.

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and then part of that is being that because I'm training John

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up on the pencil, sharper,

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Hmm,

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a lot of the little fun, little R and D things that I was previously would've

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been responsible for on the pencil.

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Sharpers is now John's job.

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So making new parts or developing new code for new products and bits and bobs.

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So he's been working away with that.

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Very cool.

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yeah.

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Just quietly making myself redundant.

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Haha.

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I mean, sounds lovely.

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Yeah,

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That's pretty weird.

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yeah

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and I keep, I keep sort of checking myself thinking this can't be, this can't be

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real or this, this won't last very long.

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yeah.

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That, yeah.

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that's pretty nice.

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I've had kind of a similar scenario, but it's only cuz we haven't had enough work.

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like hit, hit a lull where there's not many R FQs.

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We kind of tidied up all the jobs that are happening in the last week or so.

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And I don't know, I, half suspect this has always happened.

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This is part of why I get anxious about the job software being a primary

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driver of things is like revenue is there's just times when nobody

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contacts us, you know, like for like seems like forever, but it's.

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I just sit there and I think like, damn, like why, why is this happening?

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but on the other side of that is like Ricky and I have been like able to

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basically collaboratively work on finishing up like the duck, the duck

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tower, the tower of duck, and have our second prototype coming soon.

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I spent way too much time working on this tool tag thing for the

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mill room that I put on Instagram.

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It's like, each of those is a tag and they can like, they fall off

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spin so you can see it potentially,

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Yeah,

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which is kind of cool.

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So it'll like Mount up some giant magnets and it actually is like currently

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printing a 20 hour print of this that's one through 20 all of our mill

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Yeah.

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I was gonna say how many, so you got

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This is a test.

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Yeah.

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This is a test of five and I did some modifications and.

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Yeah.

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Spent

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That's cool.

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too much time yesterday on that, but

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Oh, I'm a little bit jealous of your free time.

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To be honest.

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I know it's at the cost of not having enough work, but,

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yeah,

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enjoy it.

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for sure.

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Yeah, it is, it has been that and still, it feels like every week we're

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joking, we need to dedicated day each week just to like printer repair

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or maintenance or like something happening where, so we gotta fix it.

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I think, did I mention here that we'd ended up getting a second PERA?

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I saw something hiding in a box yeah.

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In the bottom cupboard.

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yeah, we couldn't figure out first where we're gonna put it in the rookie.

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We had storage down there and we're like, let's just put it down here.

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And I was like, yeah, that's a good idea.

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So that's

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you bought another new one or second hand.

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new.

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I don't even, I didn't think about secondhand, but we've had

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so much consistency problems that I was, I can't imagine.

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I now know how to like look at stuff when it comes in, test test things to

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make sure they're in good working order.

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Whereas the first one, I just put it down.

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I was like, go do stuff, you know, like but we've had the first one has had we've

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replaced the motor in the last week.

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Cause that was the, why seemed to be having issues.

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It's still causing a bunch of crash crashes where it thinks

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it's like hitting something.

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If you have this crash detection on.

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So it's currently printing, like we've changed the nozzle and continued to

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kind of drop our time, which is sweet.

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I think we're down to four hours and 45 minutes now.

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Wow.

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That was super impressive.

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When I saw that that's amazing.

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but the surface is with wider nozzle are really, I would've expected.

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They'd be far worse, like more stepping, but it's so smooth with that new

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Iraq N slicing thing on PERA slicer.

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So we've been stoked about that.

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It's really kind of changed.

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What we need the machines to accomplish.

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Yeah.

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so what was the secret to the reduced print chart?

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Was it nozzle and the acne thing?

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RNI seems to be a hu.

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Well, both, both will do it because with the wider nozzle you can,

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it's kind of like a 50% rule.

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I think somewhere around there where 50% of your nozzles diameter

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is your kind of optimal step down.

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So by going up from 0.4 to 0.6, we go from 0.2 to 0.3 in steps.

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And so that only saved a couple hours, honestly, to change the

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step down with a wider nozzle, but.

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The difference is the, our active thing is for specifically our

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part generating the surfaces.

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It they're so much smoother.

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Like we were thinking the other day I was chatting with Ricky about one of

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'em it actually it's so good on one of the prints that you don't actually

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see the Z layers, as much as you see, like, like a, a circular pattern

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of reflection, it's like changed so much of how the code is generated.

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It just sounds smooth.

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And like it's just in that alpha build currently of peruse slicer.

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Kira actually has it too.

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They borrowed it from Kira.

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I've made a post, I can put a link to it.

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It's crazy how much it's changed.

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We, we were down like 55% where we were two weeks ago.

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And is it, I don't really understand what it is, but does

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it optimize sort of organic curve?

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So it's just more efficient movement, a smoother movement.

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I think it's doing like it's few examples I've seen it's a

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perimeter generator, first of all.

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It's looking at how the, you know, the ization or something and whatever

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the previous technology had a lot of starts and stops to it, I would say.

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and especially when you have like walls like this, where there's an outside

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and inside and then something in the middle, it kind of will fluctuate.

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Even though I've design, I modeled it consistently.

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The slicer like has trouble like going, oh, I'm gonna make a consistent

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line through the middle of it.

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So it like will put little bits and like do a little scribbling

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back and forth previously.

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And that's like all gone, which is just wild.

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That's cool.

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Yeah, that struck me watching.

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Josh's one here of how.

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Oh, it's amazing how it moves, but yeah.

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How much, little like scribble action it does on the infills

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What's Josh's printer.

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You remember?

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a CR kit of some sort, quite a large

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I would definitely look into cause both of the pretty major slicers right now,

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Kara, and it seems it's just shocking how different it is for us anyway, but

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pretty cool.

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Cool.

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mm.

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I was gonna ask you in, in your slow times, do you, do you have any background

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ads running for book shop services?

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Yeah.

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I kind of always have, I keep it pretty low.

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What I am lucky that our name is Portland.

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CNC is like kind of what you Google already.

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So like I've made enough of an SEO.

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Move that I get a lot of organic hits, do to get few a day, probably

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from a few bucks of Google ads.

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Okay.

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Yeah.

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Cause your, yeah, your organic SEO game must be pretty strong.

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The amount of sort of stuff you publish and

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Got, got pretty lucky.

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Well, it's interesting.

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I, I don't think there's a huge crossover to people that end up on

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like a blog post to like being our cus like our job shop customer.

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But I think it helps trust, you know, like

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it must help with search too.

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Right?

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Yeah, for sure.

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I think it's got to something like that.

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yeah, yeah.

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Yeah, for sure.

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So do you find Google ads effective for that?

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Those few

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that seems to have been pretty effective over the years.

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I, I honestly forgot it was turned on for like, I think I have it to like $30 a

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month as the limit or something like that.

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And it amounts to like one to four per people clicking a day.

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Additionally, I guess.

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And I can't tell you how many actually convert, but it, the conversion actually

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happens when they get to the quote page.

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And I don't know, after that, if they, how, how far they get.

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So it says they convert, but whatever, do you do ads like that?

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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We've been most of our ad spenders with Google ads at the moment.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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And, and

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pull, we pulled back from matter at the start of the year.

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We do both product and service marketing on there.

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We don't do any service marketing.

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Yeah.

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So

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we have more leads there than we can deal with.

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Because we wanna push the product side

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yeah, for

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We, we only market product.

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Yeah.

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And then that you've seen that.

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Do you have conversion rates showing on that, like that it's,

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what's working pretty well for you

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Yeah.

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it's hard to tell, like it's so up and down, like one month is

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great with product and then thought that next month is terrible.

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So July was like really, really low for us in terms of product, product sales.

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and, but at the same time, all the like Google analytics and

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the ads stats were really strong.

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Like we had heaps of traffic had more traffic than the month before

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yeah, that's

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and ad ads were seemingly performing well, but the

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conversion rate was just super low.

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Like our conversion rate in Shopify.

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Last, sorry, in June was like 0.5, four, which is the best it's ever been.

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Wow.

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And then in July it was down to 0.17, so super low,

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and we can't really work out why, other than sort of economy and, you

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know, interest rates going up and those sort of sorts of economic conditions.

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I have no answers and all the metrics look strong in terms of

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a, what the ads have been doing.

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That's a bit of it's frustrating.

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I don't think we've talked about this, Erin.

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I can't ever peg it too, actually, when it happens, but for years

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and years, I would comment to Erin about like, oh, it's so weird.

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We just get these bursts of orders sometimes, you know, and one of her

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comments, I think about a lot was well, Let's say maybe it was, maybe I was

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commenting at the start of a month.

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She was like, well, people get paid right at the start of a month or like,

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and it, it seemed somewhat corollary.

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To that, I mean, I can't say that that's the reality, but maybe it is

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like a weekly cycle where somebody got paid and they were feeling

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like, oh, I can buy something now.

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I don't know.

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Yeah.

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We've always had weird runs on products too.

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Like before we ever did any advertising, just certain set of

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shelves would sell really well one week.

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And then like, you wouldn't have sold a pegboard for months and

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then suddenly we'd sell five of them in one week sort of thing.

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It's like these weird little waves of popularity of things se with seemingly no

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trigger, but something was happening somewhere.

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for sure.

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Yeah.

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That's so weird.

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just frustration about, you know, trying to build consistency.

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In sales, particularly on the website of things.

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And then every month it's just all over the shop and we feel like

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we don't have a handle on that,

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yeah, but

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but trying to learn more, trying to delve into Google analytics and

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Google ads and actually learn, try and learn what it all means a bit more.

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Oh, I know what I was gonna say about this.

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Oh, I, I, I think a couple weeks ago, I thought I was on a kick of like

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setting up ads, especially Google ads.

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And I had never advertised our online training courses on Google

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before and Facebook had basically dropped off to not being useful.

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And so I tried it and I, I was.

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Typically I'm pretty, intentional about where I would have ads shown, but since

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it's an online course for training, I was like, let's just try the whole world,

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you know, what, what's it gonna be like?

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And I watched it for a week or so.

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I forget the budget I put in it wasn't that high $30 a week, $50

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a week or something like that.

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And just trying to experi let it experiment.

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It was like, I felt odd to me, like kind of almost wrong.

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And they would just, it was like thousands and thousands of clicks, super fast

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and zero conversion for all the time.

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It's been on, like, nobody has bought through that.

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And I'm always just like, I don't understand why, why can't I never

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figure out how this stuff works.

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Like I can keep throwing money at it.

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I can get conversion like crazy of clicks anyway.

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And then the money doesn't happen.

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I don't know.

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Mm.

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Frustrating.

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Yeah.

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Yep.

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It is.

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And I don't know enough about it.

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I think even if you are paying someone to help, it's important to sort of

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understand as much as you can, so you can ask the right questions around that

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for sure.

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stuff.

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we're bearing the lead here.

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You have a new product.

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bearing the lead?

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we do, yeah, my monthly product launch ambitions were saved

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by Ben and Josh releasing Bert the clothing rack last week.

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And it was a bit of a mad rush on Thursday, getting it all published

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and online, but we got there.

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Nice.

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Nice.

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Jay was working away, getting all the air table and Shopify and prepared.

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And turned into a real variant Fest that ended up being 19 variants.

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We thought we were launching a simple product

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and then suddenly it was like, oh, but then you can do this

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and that and that, and that.

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And suddenly there were 19 variants.

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Well, there actually, there were a lot more than that.

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And then I cuddled multiple materials.

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I was like, this is too many to go live with.

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Let's just keep it to a single material

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Yeah.

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And we shot some photos quickly on Thursday ABO and got it online.

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And then there's crickets zero response

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That's fun.

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but it was in a week where we had almost zero web sales.

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So I I was trying to sort of remind everyone after the weekend,

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not to feel like it was a flop.

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It was just like our web sales have flopped.

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It's not,

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What,

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the product is no good

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what day did that come out on?

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Did you announce it sale?

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Thursday

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Thursday night?

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I've always had a hard time and our markets could be completely different.

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I don't even know, but I've always had a hard time, like the last couple days of

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a work week, trying to put out products of any type it's like, there's almost

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too much of a rush for the weekend.

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And like, I can't think about this right now.

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I don't know.

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Maybe that's just my own personal side of it, but I have done

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enough reading that in America.

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Anyway, from what I understand, it's like the, my understanding the best day we

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can put out a product is Tuesday morning.

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thus is why we also do the podcast like that too.

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Right?

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Like we, we Googled a little bit

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and thought that might be the case.

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I don't know.

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It might be different for you, but there's all this stuff about

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like emails getting buried.

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Right.

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If you do it at night and it won't show up, like you may just not see it in

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the morning, but if a few email in the morning, you might be the top of the list.

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And Mondays people are also catching up often.

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So from the weekend, you're like have a bunch of stuff.

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So somehow Tuesday, Wednesday is like the day that you

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Interesting.

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caught up for the week.

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I don't know.

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You can try it.

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That's some gold insights.

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yeah.

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Well, Jay's funny cuz Jay's come from the sort of developer world.

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we often seem to be launching things on a Thursday, which is our Friday

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and day's always like don't you never go, never go live on a Friday.

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Cause then you spend, you spend the whole weekend fixing the bugs.

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they're gonna love this part then.

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and we always go live on Friday.

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yeah, no good to have that product out.

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Awesome.

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To see another.

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Thing come through the staff royalty program

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Uhhuh

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thing, and they just keep coming.

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We've got so many on the list.

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Yeah.

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That's awesome.

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keep pushing along.

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On your website, you have, I noticed this before you changed your theme as well.

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You have this order today for dispatch collection in

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approximately one to two weeks.

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How much effort are you guys putting into tracking that kind of thing?

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Or is it like some plugin that you kind of

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That is a lit little bit of custom code

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Yeah.

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that pulls that five days two to three weeks, whatever it

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is, that field from air table.

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Wow.

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Like live all the time.

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Yeah,

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Wow,

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but we don't change it all the time.

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sure.

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It's it's more like.

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Well, we wouldn't change it more than weekly or biweekly,

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depending on what the product is.

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Most of them are pretty static

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Yeah.

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based on the product being print on demand.

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But with something like Kitter parts, we might, if we, you know, we've got plenty

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of stock on the shelf of parts, we might change it to like two to three days,

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Yeah.

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but if we're running light on parts and we need to sort of do another batch of things

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that we might push it out to a week.

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it's one of the few bits of custom code, which I allowed on the new theme,

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cuz I really didn't want, I wanted as minimal custom code as possible.

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Yeah.

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But that was one of the things that we thought is important for people to see.

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And we feel like that really helps conversion if people can tell

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When they're gonna get it.

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when they're gonna get it.

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So we kept that.

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Yeah.

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It's nice.

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I'm just, I'm looking at your code right now.

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It's a diviv class of lead time.

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Lead time injected.

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That's a nice diviv class.

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nice.

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One, Jay.

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I love that.

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Um, Van never know how to say those names.

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That nice.

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That, yep.

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brother of Casey

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Yes.

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maker of 10 bullets,

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mm-hmm yeah, I think you worked on it.

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same narration voice

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Think he worked for him at the time.

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It's funny seeing all the similarities in like style between

Speaker:

It's

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bands, studio, and Tom Sachs

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this stuff, that's pretty cool.

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A very pleasing video.

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I thought it was interesting.

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I haven't watched a bunch of vans stuff, but I, I was really into

Speaker:

Casey's videos when he was doing all, most of his posting, but

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it was like five years ago now.

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The daily vlogging.

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I was like addict.

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My wife was watching that we would wake up and watch those in the morning.

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Like it was just like

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that's

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a kind of addicting.

Speaker:

Neither have said ever watched any vlog things before and just, I was really

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inspired by the way he made video.

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It helped me, it definitely changed my thinking of like, everything

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needed to be perfect and like, oh, you can't have like a camera shake.

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And he would like film a time lapse and then just pick up the camera

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at the end without like a cut.

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And I was just like, oh, you can do that.

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Yeah, I enjoyed them too.

Speaker:

Around that time.

Speaker:

but I find it interesting.

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They both make videos and their styles are pretty similar van and, and Casey,

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and then also the Tom sax thing.

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So it's like somewhere in between, they're like a Venn diagram.

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Yeah, I don't can't remember where I've heard it, but it was a good

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interview with one of them about how they started off making video together

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Oh, I think I,

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the types of jobs they got straight outta the gate.

Speaker:

And how that sort of built up to the point where they were making videos

Speaker:

for big artists and brands and stuff.

Speaker:

not to go too far off the path there, but the thing that was interesting, I recently

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saw it was like some podcast clip, Casey was somebody who was interviewing

Speaker:

Casey and I'll probably find it here.

Speaker:

And he was talking about how mu it's just juicy stuff.

Speaker:

That's like that, you know, we don't have these kind of numbers to share,

Speaker:

but it was, he was like, well, you know, for a hundred million views on

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my vlog, I didn't monetize the YouTube.

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Cuz I thought it was like an art project and like, it wasn't worth it.

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He's like, and then I finally decided to turn it on and I made $6,000 the

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first month and he was, and he's also saying he couldn't help pay for

Speaker:

their rent in New York at the time.

Speaker:

Like it was all his wife paying for it and they were supposed

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to be splitting it or something.

Speaker:

And he's like the next month after that 60,000.

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And he is like, it just kept going up.

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And then the brand started calling and I was like, you are making so

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much money off this that's so crazy.

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Yeah, it's wild,

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But I suppose on the video, did you watch that five principles of organization?

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Mm.

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I enjoyed it.

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Yeah, Ricky

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and I watched it here.

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interest in it?

Speaker:

I really liked particularly.

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The, just like a thing I've, I've kind of thought about and never formalized,

Speaker:

but the whole, like one hand, no stacking is like my favorite and Ricky and I are

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both like, yes, we need to go for that.

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Yeah, that was.

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What

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Yeah.

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I used to show, I used to show videos like that in staff meetings, whenever I came

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across them, like things like 10 bullets and do easy, you know, five years ago, if

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I'd just discovered that five principles of organization video, I probably would've

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shown it in the staff meeting next week, but I've stopped sharing things like that.

Speaker:

Like I might ping it to the slack channel, like the, the group chat, but

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I've stopped doing that in meetings.

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And I'm just trying to think why I reckon think I got a little bit

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tired of trying to sort of impart

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sure.

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cultural stuff

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like that and not, not feeling like it had any effect, like people would sort of

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appreciate it in the moment and enjoy it.

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Seeming.

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Mm-hmm

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but I felt like I was kind of, sort of trying to push

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an agenda.

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a cult, an agenda.

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I was kind of a workplace dynamic of like, oh, look at this new

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lean video I found from Pearson work holding, look how cool it is.

Speaker:

And then there'd be a few little nuggets.

Speaker:

I think that would reappear, but people obviously absorbed and thought

Speaker:

about, but I just felt a bit forced or something, or don't know, I

Speaker:

found myself not doing that anymore.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

I know what you mean.

Speaker:

It definitely depends on not to like speak to your team, but just from my

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experience, depends on the people.

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I can talk about Ricky, cuz he is here right now, but I think Ricky is the most

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eager to learn person I may have ever met.

Speaker:

Like, like he's always just wants to absorb everything.

Speaker:

So everything seems shareable and he's also just like the nicest person, but

Speaker:

he just is always excited about it.

Speaker:

Too.

Speaker:

So it, that makes it easy, but yeah, at times I think there's definitely been

Speaker:

a, Justin's pushing too much concept at us of lean or something, you know?

Speaker:

Yeah, I'm gonna explore that further.

Speaker:

Cause

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turns, yeah.

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Turns into like maybe like a school dynamic or something potentially.

Speaker:

Maybe that's part of it rather than sort of peers sharing ideas.

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I think.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

I think it's important to share those ideas, but I think it's more important

Speaker:

to just lead by doing, and if you follow those principles, I don't know.

Speaker:

Maybe it's important to talk about why you're doing that, but yeah, I think

Speaker:

just doing is probably more important.

Speaker:

We tried for a while when we had, it was like probably

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two months was not very long.

Speaker:

We,

Speaker:

I had this thought, I think I'd seen somebody else do it when we had a larger

Speaker:

staff was to have somebody share or teach something that they knew, because we did

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have a fairly diverse group of people.

Speaker:

and from their backgrounds and things that they learned.

Speaker:

And it is interesting how slack kind of supplant a lot of that, you

Speaker:

know, like it is almost unfortunate because it's easy to miss.

Speaker:

You can skip through stuff.

Speaker:

But it is, it allows like not forcing the whole, like.

Speaker:

Meetings.

Speaker:

Aren't great.

Speaker:

Like it, it causes a lot of people to have to listen to one at the same time

Speaker:

and it may not be pertinent to them.

Speaker:

And but yeah, I like that idea of like, it's not always the

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one person teaching, you know?

Speaker:

I, yeah, I've always loved that from, I think I got that concept from fast

Speaker:

cap of like a different person running the team, meeting every the standup

Speaker:

meeting every day or whatever it was.

Speaker:

true.

Speaker:

I don't know that we've ever tried that here, but I really like it.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

idea.

Speaker:

I kind of have like an anti meeting, which we probably should

Speaker:

get a little more formal about it.

Speaker:

We just end up like chatting for a while throughout the day, but like,

Speaker:

Mm

Speaker:

Somehow, like having a set time for meetings has never worked for me.

Speaker:

Like, I guess my regularity of everything is just, I'll be deep into something

Speaker:

and it feels like the wrong time.

Speaker:

So it's like how about later in the day?

Speaker:

And then it'll be like, either we do it or just skip it all together.

Speaker:

And it's like, why did we schedule a meeting in the first place?

Speaker:

just me.

Speaker:

feel like, well maybe, or maybe it's just the small team, you

Speaker:

Yeah, sure.

Speaker:

it's maybe if it's working fine.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

I, I certainly find great value in a structured team meeting at the same time,

Speaker:

Yeah,

Speaker:

Every week, we get a lot of value out of that.

Speaker:

Constantly fiddling with the like agenda template of what we actually talk about.

Speaker:

We don't really talk about production anymore.

Speaker:

We used to kind of run through all the jobs in the system one by one.

Speaker:

And that

Speaker:

just kind of got to a point where it was a bit of a waste of time.

Speaker:

cause everyone was either across the jobs they needed to be across or didn't

Speaker:

need to know about certain things.

Speaker:

Nice.

Speaker:

now it's a bit more of a sort of at the moment, it's a bit of a sort of

Speaker:

big picture check in of like business health sales, cuz we're pretty

Speaker:

much full open book finances now.

Speaker:

all key numbers on the table for the previous week, how the month's

Speaker:

going, that we talk about, you know, any sort of production issues that

Speaker:

need solving and bits and bobs.

Speaker:

and we try and keep it to sort of half an hour.

Speaker:

when you got eight people it's it's a lot of

Speaker:

Yeah's it expensive?

Speaker:

Fast?

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Yeah.

Speaker:

expensive exercise.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

We all drink coffee from the Makita battery coffee brewer.

Speaker:

And

Speaker:

you know,

Speaker:

Have you seen that guy before

Speaker:

funny.

Speaker:

No, I've never come across him.

Speaker:

I'm?

Speaker:

I'm a, I fan fancy myself to be a decent coffee maker and he's actually

Speaker:

really educated myself quite a bit on educated, my educated myself.

Speaker:

He's educated me quite a bit on just he won like the world barista championship,

Speaker:

which I didn't even know was a thing.

Speaker:

It was like one of those things where like YouTube just suggested him to me.

Speaker:

And I was like, oh, I'll click on it.

Speaker:

And then now I watch every one of his videos, but he's

Speaker:

just, you know, interesting.

Speaker:

I think Americans, especially we have this like myself included.

Speaker:

It's like we have this, he talks just differently enough in terms of like

Speaker:

the things he said and the pattern and, and the tone that it's like.

Speaker:

I dunno if it's easier to listen to, but it's just like more intriguing

Speaker:

sometimes than maybe somebody cause it's like, I don't know.

Speaker:

he's got a really nice presentation style.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

I like, he'll go from the crazy swing of like a $10,000 espresso machine to like

Speaker:

today, like this video we're talking about, we're gonna look at the bizarre

Speaker:

battery powered Nikita coffee machine.

Speaker:

And it's like, he runs it off at the smallest Volvo volt

Speaker:

Nikita battery I've ever seen.

Speaker:

I was like, how is that?

Speaker:

Even a thing?

Speaker:

It looked like it was like three triple a batteries.

Speaker:

There's tiny things.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

but I found it entertaining.

Speaker:

They're the little batteries that John keeps in his pocket

Speaker:

for his heated Nikita jacket.

Speaker:

Yes.

Speaker:

I thought you were gonna say it first.

Speaker:

He just keeps a battery in his pocket for like backup.

Speaker:

And I was like, man,

Speaker:

can you Just you're really keeping it tight over there.

Speaker:

Like butter.

Speaker:

Don't let 'em walk over to the battery chargers.

Speaker:

Huh?

Speaker:

No,

Speaker:

No walking!

Speaker:

no walking.

Speaker:

you lean transportation waste.

Speaker:

I was talking about seven wastes of lean yesterday.

Speaker:

Actually

Speaker:

You get a lot of like

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is seven, right?

Speaker:

heads falling down.

Speaker:

No, not to the team.

Speaker:

I was think I was thinking about it.

Speaker:

I was remembering, I think it's a Pearson video where he

Speaker:

talks about the eighth waste.

Speaker:

yes.

Speaker:

I could be totally misquoting of interpersonal drama

Speaker:

being the eighth waste.

Speaker:

Oh, interesting.

Speaker:

And I was, I had it morning yesterday where I was like, I

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have had enough of the eighth

Speaker:

A title option there

Speaker:

I just had a frustrating morning of like, just unnecessary drama.

Speaker:

for sure.

Speaker:

That's interesting.

Speaker:

So I have in our fresh desk, I have a lean page for internal use.

Speaker:

I don't think it gets much.

Speaker:

It's like only for basically people that are new or when I need

Speaker:

to remind myself what something is and the eighth waste on here.

Speaker:

I don't remember where I sourced this from is non utiliz talent.

Speaker:

So.

Speaker:

Oh, yeah, I've heard that one too.

Speaker:

the drama one.

Speaker:

I like more, but

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

I wish I could remember where I got that one, but I'm gonna

Speaker:

credit credit it to Pearon for

Speaker:

there you go.

Speaker:

So you're making epoxy river tables.

Speaker:

Is that your next project?

Speaker:

I would like to say I would never do that, but you can tell my

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stance.

Speaker:

Can we, can we just queue up an image from D of like a knack wall with epoxy spewing

Speaker:

out of the holes and they're running down.

Speaker:

God.

Speaker:

What if it knew what a knack wall was

Speaker:

Imagine it'd be quite the compliment.

Speaker:

spewing from?

Speaker:

Holes.

Speaker:

We'll see what that comes up with.

Speaker:

Gentlemen, enough with the Dall-E already!

Speaker:

They've changed it now to a credit system.

Speaker:

So it used to just be like, go wild.

Speaker:

And I like hit the limit that one time early on, which I did, there was no

Speaker:

stated limit, but I hit it and they seem to have taken heat and they're like,

Speaker:

well, we need to slow these people down.

Speaker:

So now you can buy tokens.

Speaker:

and you get a certain amount, maybe every month,

Speaker:

you're gonna have to start buying carbon offsets to like offset your server time

Speaker:

Right, epoxy.

Speaker:

we haven't talked about it particularly.

Speaker:

I have a feeling, I know how you, how you feel about river tables

Speaker:

and just that kind of like.

Speaker:

Use of epoxy as material, I guess, is what I would say.

Speaker:

and since I wrote it, I was curious what you thought, but I

Speaker:

guess I'll give my side first.

Speaker:

I, I, I think it's useful in terms of like, I've never done anything really

Speaker:

like it, I don't have an interest in it.

Speaker:

I personally don't like the idea of plastic wood or plastic being used

Speaker:

and, ways that it doesn't necessitate.

Speaker:

I think it's useful to like patch and fill solid wood when need be,

Speaker:

but not just like let's dump 10 pounds of this to make a thing.

Speaker:

And I'm not saying it's not beautiful at times, but my ethics override my interest

Speaker:

in beauty, I guess if you call it that.

Speaker:

And I actually don't really find it that beautiful, usually.

Speaker:

Look, I think, you know, where I stand I'm, I'm completely

Speaker:

disinterested in, in it as a material.

Speaker:

And just as you are talking, I was trying to think if there are any exceptions

Speaker:

to that, there is a chair which uses kind of uses it as a material or

Speaker:

it's, it's walking that line between material and adhesive by Chris TA Moya.

Speaker:

And I'll find a link for the notes, but there's this beautiful

Speaker:

chair where he is taken.

Speaker:

I think Vic Ash on Australian timber and he is physically snapped.

Speaker:

He's quite large sections of timber, like splinted them into a

Speaker:

90 degree and then cast epoxy resin.

Speaker:

To reform the corner.

Speaker:

So it's this quite an elegant,

Speaker:

oh, I've seen this.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

smash joints that are then neatly molded with epoxy.

Speaker:

And that I really liked.

Speaker:

I thought it's quite beautiful.

Speaker:

It's a clever use of sort of an adhesive becoming a decorative

Speaker:

element with these beautiful shards of timber sort of captured in it.

Speaker:

Yeah, no, I thought

Speaker:

I know that, what you mean.

Speaker:

Yep.

Speaker:

an exception, but otherwise, no,

Speaker:

not into it.

Speaker:

there was recently I have a couple friends that we have very similar

Speaker:

feelings and we chat quite a bit of when something comes up like that.

Speaker:

We usually privately give it a good critique.

Speaker:

and recently one of them found that there was some research that

Speaker:

came out that said it's in a, in a way that hadn't been said before.

Speaker:

There are some pretty serious carcinogenic problems with off gassing

Speaker:

of resin and, and kind of all forms of.

Speaker:

Like after it's cured even.

Speaker:

And like, sanding it, which is, is pretty obvious that that was the case,

Speaker:

but it, it had never really been stated.

Speaker:

I was like, all right.

Speaker:

Perfect reason why I'm never touching it.

Speaker:

I think the best, my best use case for it as an adhesive was when we were doing the

Speaker:

big fiber optic artwork five years ago.

Speaker:

And we had all these, a Luca bond cladding panels that were getting wrapped

Speaker:

around a sort of five meter column.

Speaker:

And we had about two, 2000 fiber optic fibers that had.

Speaker:

Run down the column and then come through the cladding

Speaker:

through little three mill holes.

Speaker:

And so we glued each fiber into the back of the cladding with this beautiful.

Speaker:

What was it like a scotch?

Speaker:

I a 3m, one of those little, two pack, little nozzle, gun nozzle,

Speaker:

things, cartridge, epoxy things.

Speaker:

That was wonderful.

Speaker:

Really great product.

Speaker:

Great application tool worked beautifully, but yeah, obviously there's,

Speaker:

there's hundreds of types of epoxy resin, probably more epoxy adhesives,

Speaker:

my favorite is when they call it eco like I think there's a brand called Oxy

Speaker:

and I think that's false advertising.

Speaker:

I tend to agree.

Speaker:

I'll switch it up here from our away from our favorite thing, epoxy to I've had a

Speaker:

lot of good comments, encouraging me for our choice to adopt, to not shop no to

Speaker:

What?

Speaker:

that's a stupid thing about pets to adopt.

Speaker:

Adopt don't shop

Speaker:

for Pets It's a,

Speaker:

are for Christmas.

Speaker:

Kittens are for Christmas.

Speaker:

TAs are for life.

Speaker:

That's what they say, right?

Speaker:

Oh, no, it was about my ake kitchen.

Speaker:

everybody I've had a few messages about how it was the right thing

Speaker:

to do and that their spouse would, similar to myself that it it's better

Speaker:

to have moved that way than to have fought it for another two years and

Speaker:

totally.

Speaker:

made a more expensive solution.

Speaker:

But in particular, as I mentioned, Rob Lockwood and I were working

Speaker:

kind of collaboratively on a thing.

Speaker:

He, he, his first thing is like, I just turned, I just turned off my podcast.

Speaker:

When I heard you bought an Ikea kitchen.

Speaker:

I'm so disappointed.

Speaker:

and he is like, actually, I just got to work.

Speaker:

I'd love to see what you've done with fusion cabinet templates.

Speaker:

I'll show you mine.

Speaker:

If you show me yours

Speaker:

, yeah.

Speaker:

We've, we've had fun with parametric template building.

Speaker:

That might be a good, next one.

Speaker:

We'll have to figure out how to screen share.

Speaker:

I think where I will finally solve all of this and I don't have an ETA

Speaker:

on it, but I've heard they're working on configurations, which is like

Speaker:

a thing that came from Solidwork and other modeling softwares where

Speaker:

you can,

Speaker:

inventor has that too.

Speaker:

yeah, you can basically, I don't even know how to describe it, but it will

Speaker:

solve the things I'm trying to solve with like, is your cabinet left or right

Speaker:

handed or, you know, like, and it pulls in those parameters more dynamically cuz

Speaker:

right now that's I was trying to basically hack my way into the standard way fusion

Speaker:

uses, that to, Make it work with like binary toggles , if it's a zero go right.

Speaker:

And it just, just fricking breaks every possible time.

Speaker:

I think I had it.

Speaker:

And I, there was also, I might have said it here, but for a while, I,

Speaker:

I frankly call it a virus and I think they have somewhat resolved

Speaker:

it finally, but there was a thing in the product design extension,

Speaker:

which I don't think many people had.

Speaker:

I had it cause I'm in this, influencer program,

Speaker:

group.

Speaker:

it was turned on by default and I wasn't even using it, but it was

Speaker:

removing data from your fields.

Speaker:

When say you go to extrude and you typed in a parameter, it would remove

Speaker:

that information and just put a number

Speaker:

in.

Speaker:

Wow.

Speaker:

was like terrified.

Speaker:

It was just eating away at all of our files.

Speaker:

And I think it's still there and it was just erasing it every time you'd open it.

Speaker:

So you couldn't see your parameters anymore.

Speaker:

And I was like, oh my God, that's when I stopped working on the cabinets because

Speaker:

I was like, well, I can't right now.

Speaker:

And then I was like a month and a half ago.

Speaker:

My cabinets have been hacked.

Speaker:

yes, exactly.

Speaker:

Frightening.

Speaker:

Unlike what I'm going to do to them soon, pack them in a different way.

Speaker:

what are you doing for the doors?

Speaker:

You mentioned bamboo.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

Like I think there's probably Pinterest, my wife and I are Pinteresting kitchens

Speaker:

and, just vertical grain, bamboo doors, slab front what were we gonna do?

Speaker:

I think they might have ledge poles now, but we were thinking about making 'em.

Speaker:

So you'd have like a pull from behind, but it didn't quite

Speaker:

work in a few circumstances.

Speaker:

So like a carbonized vertical bamboo play

Speaker:

yes.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

Think something like that.

Speaker:

material.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

I like it.

Speaker:

We, we were going round and round with I don't know if you're like this.

Speaker:

It's like, sure.

Speaker:

We wanna enjoy our house.

Speaker:

We're not sure we're gonna stay there for 10 more years.

Speaker:

And I think in like the design community, we may be okay with like

Speaker:

exposed edge Baltic, Birch or plywood.

Speaker:

Right.

Speaker:

But the most people like a slab front of Baltic Birch when the edge

Speaker:

is exposed, it just doesn't really, that's kind of what we were thinking.

Speaker:

And so we're like, I don't know, at least Bamboo's kind of natural that way.

Speaker:

Like it shows its edge kind of naturally.

Speaker:

does have a nice end grain detail.

Speaker:

It's nice to machine.

Speaker:

I like it.

Speaker:

It's really expensive here.

Speaker:

I haven't done much with it cause it's a bit prohibitive,

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

It's all imported here from Asia, I

Speaker:

yeah, of course.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Speaker:

I got invited to, be a guest speaker at like a fusion open house

Speaker:

community meetup in a couple of

Speaker:

Sweet.

Speaker:

And my immediate thought was like, oh crap.

Speaker:

I better do some more work infusion.

Speaker:

Just

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like really like clunk.

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I can't figure out how to use this right now.

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Sorry.

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I've been using rhino for the last few months.

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I can't remember.

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How does this work again?

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do you guys have rhino on this?

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That's cool.

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Just quite

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Hmm, that'd be fun.

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Just a little thing,

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the local house reseller, I believe

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buying a mill.

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Aren't you

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Well, maybe it will.

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it comes with that's your speaker bonus.

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They just give you like a minimi.

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sure.

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I'll I'll take it.

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we'll talk about fusion.

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Sure.

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Not to do yours.

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I got invited to it's interesting.

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We have a similar timing, a, thing in the UK.

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For fusion, they invited me for,

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Live sync up.

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I think they're calling it.

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So I need to book my flight today.

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that should be pretty interesting.

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I haven't been to the UK other than like flying through and haven't gone anywhere

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that far in a long time with COVID.

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So that was my instigation of making those stupid masks with cheeseburger,

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I was, I was chatting with my friends, like, what's the best mask for flying,

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you know, like I wanna quick take it off and like eat a cheeseburger and

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awesome.

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Nice one.

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Well, I hope that goes ahead.

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Yeah, me too.

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It should.

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I mean, I think I just have to pick a flight this point, but yeah, it'll be fun

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Hmm.

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Awesome.

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the UK is farther in time from where I am to you.

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So it'd be like more hours apart, right?

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No, no idea.

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I'm glad you

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time zones are not time.

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Zones are not my strength.

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Wolf from alpha.

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Let's see.

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On that riveting note, there's a good book about that actually

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Time zones.

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I'm not reading that.

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it's called Longitude.

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I can never remember the difference between neither of those.

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longitude.

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The true story of a loan genius who solved the something.

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It's a good book about the discovery of longitude time

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Oh, there you go.

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I didn't

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realize that was the thing

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for the week.

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I know.

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I'm glad I remembered this.

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Have you, or can you, can you access the show?

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The bear on Hulu?

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Have you heard of this?

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Roar

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! I'm a Bear

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I don't know.

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Cool is like doesn't exist here.

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It doesn't.

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Ah, damn there's a very good show called the bear that I watched in

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two days with my wife and it like, it's filmed in a very unique way.

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I feel like it's like a lot of one camera following around and it's about the

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chef and cooking in Chicago and, yeah.

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Anyway, very good.

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If maybe if people wanna, if you can't watch it, I guess we won't talk about it.

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That'd be kind of weird, but,

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There are people that on, you know, your side of the world who listen to

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this, I believe it's not all, it's not an exclusively Australian audience, so

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It'd be funny if it's just me

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yeah.

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America.

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Nobody else listened here.

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hot tip.

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I was very good.

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I enjoyed it.

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It was very creative and I was like watching other people's

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creativity in, in their fields.

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Yeah, totally me too.

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How did you go with the aluminum part?

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oh.

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I was up very late that night.

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I talked to you trying to get it done.

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maybe that was the day after I forget, it went well I don't know how to describe it.

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It just takes me forever because I'm always afraid I'm gonna crash

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things that I haven't set something.

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Right.

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I could not for the life of me, which I found out is actually

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just plain bad infusion.

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You can't, even if you set your fixturing as like fixturing in

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the setup, it doesn't avoid it.

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not who I would it.

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it just tells you that you hit it in the simulation.

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So I was using these clamps to hold it down in the corners.

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And I was terrified that I was gonna just run through those,

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these clamps with my tools.

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So that probably took me like another three or four hours of trying to

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get the cam to work as it should.

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So apparently there's a potential future solution there that they're working on.

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it made me really sure that I wanna put a fixture plate on the mill, because part.

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The challenge.

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I really didn't have the right tools.

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Like I really need or fixturing, I needed side hold this inch plate

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of aluminum and I couldn't anyway.

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I could buy some cheap things, but I don't wanna have to take everything

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off, down to the table every time and not have a way to put it back on quick.

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So, yeah, definitely.

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I think we'll be calling Saunders at some point and we've got, 'em

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quoted before, but now I kind of know what I want versus back then.

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I was just like, let's just see what it cost.

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So that'll be nice.

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Yeah.

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Fantastic.

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Well done clock that time as training.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, for sure.

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I'll bill that to myself.

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all right.

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See ya next week.

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Have a good afternoon.

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I'll see you then.

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Bye.

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you miss.

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do you really spell it different?

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I thought you just said it differently.

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How do you spell it?

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How do you spell it?

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Oh, you really do put another eye in there.

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I just, I didn't know that.

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okay.

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okay.

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These are kind of cool not to extend forever, but I was trying to test the,

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Extruding factor say like do this little formula and you print spiral base mode.

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So this is literally a single wall of filament and it's like super

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flexible, but super good quality.

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You can kind of tell, I, I don't know if the quality is good enough in these

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images, but it's like reflective.

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It's so clean.

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It gave me some ideas for

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sure.

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Iraq N

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spiral based mode and it literally spirals all the way.

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There's no stops.

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now I have these like stacking blocks on my desk.

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There's just always like stupid things to play with that I've been like making

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for a while and they just sit here.

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I was looking at my, my I've got a little box of shame here.

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It's got some really random stuff in it,

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Box of shame.

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including done.

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Would appreciate these good little conduit cutter

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Oh yeah.

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What do you think about that?

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Done?

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All in a days work...

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you know.

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con cutter.

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Yeah.

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You've got like real tools.

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Mine's just little junk.

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I guess I got a lot of fixed, a lot of hardware.

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oh, there's plenty of jump.

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What what's on your desk?

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How about some cross Dell nuts

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Oh

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project for my mom that I haven't finished in months.

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I'll raise you.

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I'll raise you.

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Here we go.

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An RCA port out of a tape player that I pulled apart 15 years ago.

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that beats me for age, for sure.

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On parts of my desk.

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that it's already outta hand.

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We're we're doing desk show and tell alright.

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See you, man.

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But

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Oh, thank you for being a great guest.

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Oh, thank you, Z.

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Does it say

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Yeah.

Speaker:

mine?

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About the Podcast

Show artwork for Parts Department
Parts Department
Justin Brouillette (Portland CNC) and Jem Freeman (Like Butter) discuss CNC machines, their product design and manufacturing businesses, and every kind of tool that they fancy.

Listen for free

About your hosts

Profile picture for Jem Freeman

Jem Freeman

Co-founder and director of Like Butter, a CNC focussed timber design and manufacturing business in their purpose-built solar-powered workshop. Castlemaine, VIC, Australia.
Profile picture for Justin Brouillette

Justin Brouillette

Founder of Portland CNC & Nack